Wednesday, August 10, 2022

Medicine VS Science Degrees | 6med Surgery

Okay so i'm not sure how many more people um will be joining but i think we'll just start now anyway um thank you for joining today everyone and if you've got any questions throughout the talk or afterwards about anything related to medical applications science degrees anything like that please pop it in the chat and i'll try and answer everything.

As best as i can so my name's ella i'm a fourth year medic at the university of manchester at the moment and just about to finish my fourth year and this talk is going to be on how you can decide whether medicine's right for you and sort of the other options out there either if you don't get into medicine or if you feel that.

Medicine might not be exactly what you're looking for in terms of degrees so as an introduction there are so many different jobs in healthcare and way more than just doctors um it's really interesting actually if you look.

At the structure of like the nhs um who is actually there helping so if you've always dreamt of being a doctor and working and helping people um it doesn't mean that you have to be a doctor to accomplish that if you're really interested in statistics there are loads.

Of jobs and statistics and um working within the nhs um there's you know nurses there's loads of different jobs um so just because you want to work in healthcare doesn't mean you have to go and do a medical degree again there's so many different degrees.

Available within sort of field of science and healthcare and they're all great and it's just which is right for you so many people will say you know which is the best and honestly it's just what suits you best more so than um which is actually.

You know the most worthwhile so things to think about while you're deciding what exactly it is you want to do your opinion is what matters most i hear so many people who are thinking of applying to medicine because their parents really want them to be doctors.

Or because their whole life growing up they've thought like that's the best job there is things like that um they're not really great reasons for going into medicine this really long degree you see really difficult things and and so it's best that you're.

Passionate about it and if you feel like you're being pushed into medicine and it's not what you think is best for you then really cling onto that and bear that in mind while you're making your decision do your research don't just apply i mean all of you guys here.

And just by coming to these talks are doing some research but don't just sort of jump in head first without knowing what exactly you're signing up for and think about what is important to you what is your interests um what are your values what exactly are you looking for in terms of a university degree and.

When you sort of look at them as a whole is medicine right for you if not which of these other options are so i'm going to spend a little while talking about the different options um out there for someone interested in pursuing science at university and as a career in general.

And then i will talk to you a little bit later about um sort of the things that you might want to bear in mind little pros and cons of each um and the values you might have when deciding so thinking about science at university.

There's pure science courses which um similar to any other university course uh usually three years um and you can do longer courses within the different sciences um either taking a year abroad um or within industry which means almost a little like an apprenticeship where you go work for a company for a.

Year um but yeah usually just standard courses medicine is slightly longer course usually five to six years and obviously you become a doctor after qualifying and to become a doctor you have to take medicine and slightly different traditional.

University courses medical related degrees things like biomedical sciences more medical content but you don't become a doctor at the end of it and so somewhere in between the science degree and a medical degree and then i wasn't sure whether or not to include.

These but i think it's something that a lot of people applying to medicine aren't really aware of these options out there and if you're really interested in working in care with patients and and you're not sure if medicines for you then these degrees are really helpful and they're the allied health profession.

Degrees such as nursing um in the end you do end up in healthcare career and but they're shorter courses than medicine and slightly less intense so looking at science degrees as a whole so they're very detailed and science.

Based so what that means is it goes into detail um on actual scientific processes and it sort of just focuses on that instead of any real world application although it is worth thinking that depending on which science degree you choose that.

Will vary slightly um obviously when you go to university don't just do a degree called science you would choose either biology or chemistry engineering something like that or there's something much more detailed so maybe plant biology for example.

Or biochemical engineering things like that yeah massive choice of degrees um all at different universities honestly an endless amount you can choose from and again all focus on slightly different things three to four years.

Um again usually the three years but four years if you want to go and do a year abroad or a year in industry mostly talk through labs and lectures so you'll have lectures you go home and write some essays or projects on them um and then you also have labs which is a little bit like school school science.

Lessons where you let's say you were doing chemistry you could you would do certain experiments to sort of demonstrate what you're learning in your lectures and be able to visualize them better they also have the option for flexible modules so if you're particularly.

Interested in a very specific topic within your degree that you would be doing um you have the option to sort of choose that and if there's something you're less interested in doing you don't have to do that they do have fixed modules but usually they're sort of the more general.

Um topics and then you get to choose what exactly you're interested in and go into more detail on those and again opportunities for years of boards and placements they have shorter contact hours this might not be a phrase you guys are really aware of.

Contact hours is how many hours you spend actually in university a week usual degrees have quite short contact hours and a lot of the work you do at home um such as essay writing things like that so science degrees do have slightly longer contact hours than an arty subject but they have short contact.

Hours in the sort of bigger picture of science degrees in medicine and this is really great if you really want the university experience where you'll have a great social life you'll make lots of friends if you want to work a part-time job things like that um you.

Might be looking at having a shorter contact hour degree and and yes then a science degree might be more suited for you yeah more essays and projects than a medical degree that might be something you are interested in maybe you're really good at writing essays and you want that to.

Be part of where your marks are coming from um that's also if you're interested a bit more in research going home and writing essays on things that you've researched yourself might interest you and they are much more commonly seen in just.

General science degrees yeah like i said time for lots of extracurricular activities um literally whatever you're interested in time for a part-time job which is obviously really important some people and technically there's less time socializing with other people from your.

Course because you go in you have lectures that you might have projects with small groups of people from your course but generally people who do science degrees are similar to those who do other general university degrees where most of the people they will meet will be through societies from.

A wide variety of different courses um outside their degree which is great it's a good thing so the life sciences all the sort of medical related sciences um are a sub category of science degrees um some are more medical related uh.

And often they are quite so narrow focused so you can do like an anatomy degree or you could do biomedical science degree or biomedical engineering things like that biomed degrees especially a very very similar to the first couple of years of a medical degree but they just don't focus on the.

Clinical detail as much in medicine you were taught the basic science and then you're taught how to apply that to real life cases so for example in a biomed degree you might learn the specific processes that go towards.

Is causing a disease but in a medical degree you will learn a bit more about how to identify that disease and focus less on the actual details of what's causing it so less clinical detail but you still um depending on the course you choose can have a sort of medical focus.

If you don't get into medicine or you're thinking maybe in the future i might want to do medicine but it's not for me right now and life science degrees are really good because that means that when you do start medicine you already have that really solid foundation of knowledge um which will set you up really well.

Everyone i know who's done a biomed degree and then gone on to do medicine does really really really well so if you're thinking maybe medicine in the future then these kind of degrees you know really helpful um with science degrees.

There's options to further your education after your what would be called like a bachelor of science degree um so you have the opportunity to take a master's or a phd now you do have the opportunity in medicine to also take masters or phds but it's not actually that popular anymore because.

If you're going to be a doctor it no longer really back in the day when i first died my degree you used to be able to if you took a masters or a phd you'd get extra points when you first applied um for your foundation programs the first years you're a doctor.

No it no longer contributes um to those points anymore so it's not very popular to now take a master's or phd if you do want to be a doctor um and also you have to think if you're already taking five or six years you don't want to take any more years on top.

Of that um but in science degrees very very popular to go on and stay at uni for an extra couple of years and get these other degrees they are much more reset research and teaching based so especially phds you do have to do part of.

Your sort of part of your degree would be teaching like younger students and so if teaching or research is something you're interested in it would be a really good sort of path to take to do a bachelor of science and then move on and and take your master's and phd in.

Your subject and also masters and phd subjects are much more narrow um you can choose your field of interest when you take them and ultimately you can end up working as a professor for the university um or doing research for the university and phds you do get paid you get.

Sponsored to do them so in terms of careers and science you can still work in medicine you're just not a doctor so if you think about in oncology which is medicine of cancers they have loads of people working in labs looking at microscopes with.

The different cells under them and then you obviously have people who work doing the blood tests things like that um so you can still be very hands-on in terms of patient treatment you're just not the doctor again like i said before you can go into.

Research um it could literally be any type of research so let's say you're interested in health care it could be things like cancer treatment research but if you're interested in other things loads of businesses.

Require people's work in the lab so for example in cosmetics in food science all of those and big companies need scientists again teaching there's so many opportunities within science to be a lecturer to be a professor even go back to like a secondary school and teach science um a lot of people who.

Go into science love teaching and will end up doing at least some of that in whatever they're going to in the future but it's also worth saying like the skills that you get in a science degree is transferable to any job let's say you do chemistry um like no.

Employer out there will think that's a bad degree um i know lots of people who did biology chemistry engineering at university and then went to go work in finance or fashion or whatever so if you're not really sure um what it is in the future you want to.

Go into but you are interested in science at the moment um it is worth thinking that a science degree is not going to sort of shoot horn you into a specific niche at the moment let's talk a bit more about medicine which i think most of you will be at least interested in a little bit.

So the degrees of five to six years depending on where you go usually oxbridge six years most other universities are five years um there are four year courses in medicine but you have to have a previous degree before you can do them everyone studies the same thing for the.

Whole time um there are no optional modules you obviously just have to learn everything um because it's there for a reason and you don't get to specialize until later in your career anyways you will be a doctor who needs to know the general stuff although depending on what university you are.

At so for example at manchester we have a project each year just one project one essay each year and we're allowed to choose what topic we do that on so if you're interested in law you can focus on medical law or if you're specifically interested in palliative care which is end of life care you could focus more on that but generally in the.

Day-to-day everyone studies the same thing again you do obviously get some scientific background and but it's mainly applied to clinical cases um a lot of universities as well in the last few years of placement-based so you.

Really don't get any more basic science teaching um again though that will vary between which university you're thinking of applying to oxbridge and the universities that are more traditional will focus more on research and scientific content whereas.

Any university which is more pbl based will be very clinical and less so scientific um obviously you have to learn practical skills we taught things like how to examine a patient how to take blood how to do certain surgical techniques so that's obviously included in medicine you wouldn't see that in a science.

Degree um and the degree is taught using lectures labs and placements as well as pbl sessions dissection communication skills sessions again depends on which university you go to of course but um there's a much.

Higher proportion of the teaching will be in person um actually getting stuck in getting involved and having practical practice and more so than they're actually just sitting there talking at you teaching you things much longer contact hours.

Um especially in your last couple of years of medicine so i'm in my fourth year my penultimate year of my course and i'm on placement like sometimes eight till seven so like that's obviously a very very long day um in your first couple of years longer.

Con it'll be longer contact hours than a regular degree but probably less so than that amount of time um yeah your final years are usually placement focused and you have a lot of time socializing with other medics because you're always on placement or you're always in university.

And regularly changing groups and with so much practical work you obviously just get to know each other really really well but on the flip side of that you don't have as much time outside of university to meet other people from different courses.

Of course you can do that still and it just happens a little bit less so if you're thinking oh i don't want to just have medic friends then um you know it's something to think about although i would say medicine is a hard degree so it's nice being friends with people who know what.

You're going through so doing medicine like later on in life is actually very common i know when you're in sixth form and you're sitting there thinking oh i've got myself my mind up now um it's actually not really the case so many people on my course were i think like majority of people hadn't.

Come just straight from school there were even people who were in their 40s who were starting medicine at that point of their lives you might have other priorities before committing to medicine whether that's maybe you have a child or whether you really really want to travel and you know that as a doctor you won't be able.

To do that or maybe you want to save some money up ready to sort of put a deposit on the house before you go and do medicine and that's obviously fine you just have to know what you prioritize and what's important to you before um.

So before you apply maybe you just want to get on with it and and go straight into medicine that's also great but um you think just think about your individual case and yeah it's absolutely fine if you have other priorities medicine really is a lifestyle when you start it it takes up a lot of your time.

And especially after medical school and in your first couple of years being a doctor you don't really have time for anything else many young doctors are in relationships for example um so if you have other priorities and you want to get them done before going to medical school it's completely understandable.

You might think about taking a gap year if you want to travel or save some money up first doing another degree is obviously a great sort of opportunity if you want to go to university now but you're not not thinking about medicine yet and you might want to go and do another.

Career quite a lot of people going to be a health care assistant for example and then come back and apply for medicine later on um when they're convinced that they do want to do it career in medicine feels obvious i'm sure you guys know what happens once you graduate from medical school you either become a doctor or a surgeon usually.

Um obviously straight after medical school there's more training before you can become a surgeon but um generally that's what most people are going to doing there are also i think they're called research surgeons where they.

Primarily focus on research although any doctor has the opportunity to go into research if they want or drug development usually is a common one to go into medical education is also very popular if you're not thinking you want to do medicine full time you can teach medical students you can teach young doctors.

And that can be either bedside teaching which is teaching the doctors or medical students in the hospital with cases or that can be like as a lecturer with a university and there's obviously so many different specialities within each of these sub sections.

Like loads that you won't ever even heard of and i always get surprised when sixth formers um say to me oh i know i want to be an obscene gynae doctor because really you guys haven't had any experience of what the different specialties are and when you join medical school you'll find.

All these weird and wacky ones um that will change your mind about a million times so there's even though after medical school there's really one job that you're going into doing within that job there are so many different.

Um very different subspecialties so if you're not sure about medicine yet or you're struggling to get onto a medical degree there are some other jobs which are quite new they've only been invented in.

The past couple of years which are very very similar to doctors they're just not doctors um primarily physicians associates is like the really popular one and what that is is you go and do a biomedical science degree usually and then after that you take two extra.

Years at university being taught how to examine patients clinical reasoning things like that and what you then go and do is work in a hospital or a gp under a doctor and you do a similar job to what a junior doctor would do taking a history and examining the patient then you'll go.

And present it to your doctor um supervisor who will sort of you know make sure you're not doing anything wrong and give you advice on how to treat that patient and then you go back and you treat the patient yourself so really you're acting like a doctor but you just have to be.

Supervised by a consultant but if you're interested in working in patients and interested in the actual processes that like the problem solving for example that a doctor will do um but you can't get into a medical degree then doing a different degree and.

Then becoming a physicians associate is a really good option and it's really popular now advanced practitioners usually do an allied health profession so very commonly they are paramedics who go back to university to have extra training and then again they work similar to this physicians associate.

Where they do the same job as a doctor they just have to be supervised um but obviously those training programs are much shorter than medicine so it's a great option i didn't really know whether to include this because most of you here will be interested in.

Human science but obviously there are options in dentistry and veterinary science obviously as well nurses within those um specialties as well and the courses are very very similar to a medical course usually five or six years have placements.

And they have a similar application process to medicine so allied health professions there are loads these are just some examples of some that you can come across um literally everything from a nurse or a midwife to clinical psychologist to.

A physio to an occupational therapist to opticians and each of those have their own degree sort of assigned to them so if you want to be a nurse you have to go do a nursing degree there are optician degrees available et cetera et cetera so they obviously all work in healthcare.

And are really really important members of the team they have a great job because they get to work really directly with patients even some doctors don't get a lot of time face to face with the patients but obviously these professions do um.

Depending on which one you go into there can be diagnostic work problem solving sort of integrated into their jobs um think of an example so either for example a nurse maybe initially wouldn't have that aspect of um.

Work but as they got more senior they could have actual training and be allowed to be a nurse practitioner and then they could be able to diagnose conditions themselves obviously as well an optician has certain training in terms of eye health diagnostics.

Um the difference is they are very specialized from early on so usually if you want to be like a mental health nurse you have to go and do that degree so you're just very focused on a very specific aspect of health care and there are also options to do apprenticeships in some of those.

Professions so for example healthcare resistance you don't need a degree to do that so if you wanted to just go straight from universe straight from school into the healthcare there are training courses which are offered by for example gps or hospitals that can get you straight into them.

Without a degree um yeah often heavily placement based i don't know how much you know about nursing courses especially famously very placement-based but they have almost full-time placements from i think it's second semester so halfway through their.

First year whereas medicine usually you have an occasional placement and then you're fully placement based sort of by midway through your degree and like from what i've learned from being on placement is allied health profession students are really part of the team and.

They really help their patients sometimes as a medical student you can feel like you're not really doing a lot to help and because obviously you're there to learn and sort of the work the doctors do is obviously quite difficult sometimes whereas a nursing student can do almost.

Everything a nurse can do they're just being supervised so really hands-on really rewarding from early on and the courses are usually three years you can of course do multiple consecutive degrees um so for example do like a biomed science degree and then do medicine afterwards.

Yeah common taking medicine is a postgraduate degree you could also switch degrees before graduating so very commonly universities will have all the similar degrees have the same first year it's quite hard to explain but let's say general biology.

And then plant biology for example their first year will often cover very similar content so at the end of first year if you think actually maybe one of those isn't for me but this other course which is very similar is more for me a lot of universities will let you just switch degrees at the end of your first year without basically.

Without questioning you so that's an option obviously as well if a dewey is not for you you can drop out and start another degree at any point my point really with this was just that your decision doesn't need to be final i see so many people who are really stressed about having to make a decision now you guys.

Are still young and um your opinion on what you'll do will change like a million times and that's fine you just have to try things out and not force yourself into anything basically just need to know that there's lots of options out there and.

If something's not for you there is obviously the option to change any point so i'm just going to talk quickly about some things just to take into account when you're trying to make your decision is it medicine or is it just general science for me so think about your values and passions so you might want to do a science degree.

If you really are interested in learning about the details really thinking about in-depth information if you're really interested in teaching as well um a science degree might like make that a little bit easier for you give you more opportunities in teaching.

And obviously helping people if you go into a career in science you are helping people no matter what you do medicine usually a more problem-solving sort of aspect clinical aspect and very hands-on more practical skills a more practical degree and even our exams are usually practical and again obviously helping.

People allied health professionals more focused on a very specific topic if you are interested in let's say mental health or eye health or something you can focus nice and quickly um team working and the opportunity to work within the team very early on it's obviously very very hands-on and less so.

You know sitting down reading books and obviously helping people i wanted to put helping people for all of those because so many so many people will be like i want to be a doctor because i want to help people but all of these professions um you know help people so it's sort of a.

Bit of a moot point really so what do they require obviously something you need to think about before you um apply for a subject is do i have the right qualifications to let me actually get a place there so science degrees really.

Vary depending on which university you're looking at which science degree you're looking at so really there's something for everybody generally on the whole lower grades the medicine are required although very good universities the grades will be very similar to medicine so.

Um again it just depends where you're applying often you need science a levels usually two but sometimes only one and quite often you should have one in the science which is similar to what you're looking at studying um and your grade requirements.

May include epq so if you're doing an epq they often will take that into account in a science degree and maybe alter your grade slightly your grade requirements slightly medicine is usually three a's or an a star two a's sometimes more than that i've never ever seen.

A medical course ask for less than three days unless you're going through a very specific route where you're a disadvantaged student and sometimes they will offer special places for those individuals but high grades basically.

Um and you need two science a levels and most universities will say you need chemistry but they don't mind which other sign stay scalable is um and on the whole epq's cannot be counted um as like they can't be taken into account.

Basically in medicine you won't get altered grades if you've done an epq the only way an epq is useful for you is if you talk about it in your personal statement or your interview but in terms of actually contributing to reduced grades it won't help allied professions they generally have quite low grade.

Requirements i think nursing is usually bbc or three b's something like that um and often you need one science a level or if you're doing if you're at college you know one sort of topic to be kind of science related.

And then the application process science is exactly the same application process as um any other degree would be any arts degree or any humanities degree and you just go through ucas you submit your personal statement and then they will contact you with an offer.

And it's quite rare for them to ask for an interview although it does happen i know manchester interviews for biomed students just because so many of their biomass students are actually medics and so they do interview them and really your application needs to be a focus on.

Um why you're interested in the topic you're applying for medicine has what's called early application for ucas so you have to have your ucas form sent off by an earlier date than other degrees um you obviously require work experience.

To like really stand out that doesn't necessarily mean you know doing a week in hospital but you have to have some experience in the healthcare field or volunteering something like that um you have to take admissions tests to get into medicine you cats or the bmat and.

Then you always will have an interview for medicine i like professions again like such a wide variety of um such a wide variety within like which you choose like the applications will vary so much but usually normal.

Applications some times they have an interview and obviously they don't always require work experience but i really would recommend it if you're going to an allied profession degree because you aren't so sure you're finding yourself in quite.

Early on so i always see people going and applying for mental health nursing for example and they've never had any experience working with mental health patients i would say that's not a great idea because you might not actually like it when it comes around to actually working.

With them the content um science again like i keep hopping on about it more detailed more scientific and less applied um more labs more experiments things like that whereas medicine is more clinical knowledge and being able to take that.

Information from a patient and working it into a diagnosis as well as practical skills and then allied health professions usually practical skill base and they do have some scientific knowledge worked into that but it's much less in-depth than medicine or science.

I've also already talked about this but if you're wanting sort of a more usual university experience science is a great option less contact hours more chance outside of your degree to do things medicine obviously more contact hours but still has a great community often has its own medical societies which help work around your.

Specific needs um yeah so more specialized to the needs of a medic for example um having more flexible training times for the sports societies and and then again allied health professions much more contact i was very.

Placement-based but again great community really lovely people life after university it's science massive opportunities massive amount of different opportunities really depends on what you're looking to.

Get out of a future job um but usually those jobs are nine to five um medicine following graduating medical school you have 10 years before becoming a consultant and during that time you have a lot of exams a lot of learning um still to do.

You are guaranteed a job after university um start like you have to go and choose one and apply you were just guaranteed one but the hours are very social a lot of hard work very emotional work um great work i feel like i'm being quite.

Harsh on medicine i obviously chose medicine it i love it it's a great very rewarding um degree and career but it is worth thinking am i ready to sort of you know focus on medicine am i passionate enough to really want to give all that time to medicine because if not maybe science is it's more down your.

Alley and then i like to help professions start earning your money really early can be anti-social hours as well obviously depending on what which profession you're going into and again you're pretty much guaranteed a job um i know a few people who did allied.

Health professions so for example one of my friends is a paramedic i'm still at university now she has graduated she same ages me she put a deposit on her house she's very very happy it's very settled now and so it's great if that's the kind of thing you're looking for wanting to settle down quite early and.

Um getting to work and help early on um and i was gonna say something else and the other thing is as well is the nhs needs so many more allied health professions for professionals so there's so many jobs available everywhere so many degree places.

Available again we've already talked about that um so if you still want to decide it there's like where to go next is you need to talk to some real students doing those courses.

Ask questions to every medical student you meet literally pester them we all are so happy to talk and answer your questions um but yeah just talk to real students doing that course they're the people who know best as to how that course is running.

Yeah ask so many questions if you're sitting there and not asking questions that there's really a waste opportunity um if you go on an open day for example just ask anything that you're like worried about anything that you're confused about and people will answer everyone doing all these courses are.

Super friendly read books and articles on the topics um there are so many books out there written by doctors about the life of a doctor um really great one is adam k this is going to hurt you might have watched the recent.

Program of that um that's very depressing it is kind of accurate but also very depressing to just watch that with a pinch of salt but the book is very very good there are so many others out there um read science articles things like that see if you're interested in the more scientific research based aspect.

And do work experience if you've not had the chance to see healthcare from the point of view of healthcare workers then you how can you know like for sure whether you're gonna like it or not i think so many people are hesitant when they haven't had the chance to do work experience because they think oh i'm.

Sort of jumping into the great unknown which medicine really is because you won't have had the chance to ever study medicine before going to university so in summary prioritize what's important to you and what you want is the most important more important than what anyone else.

Wants for you just think of the pros and cons because they're a massive pros and massive cons for all of those options and think about what you want for your future so i'll answer some questions i'm just going to grab some more water quickly because my throat is seizing up a little bit and please just put some questions.

In the chat and i'm happy to answer them okay someone asked will there be a talk about the difference between dentistry and medicine i don't think there is um i don't think there is but i think that six med has information on it on their website from what i remember um.

but i don't think there's going to be a specific talk on it so i'm sorry if you have any questions about dentistry medicine i can answer it i obviously never applied for dentistry but i have friends who did so i can try and talk a little bit about it but it's not my error of expertise.

Okay what is a typical job following on from biomed anatomy degree so it really depends on what you're interested in doing um there are so many different jobs that are available obviously if you go and want to do phd then your job will be very research.

Based or teaching based or if you want to go into actual healthcare with your degree um lab techs are the most common um but within that there are so many different job opportunities so like i already said you might be working with a.

Pathologist for example in doing histology which means looking under microscopes the different cells you might be more pharmaceutical based where you're looking at the effectiveness of medication it really depends on what you're interested in but again there's no.

It doesn't mean that just because you've done a biomed degree you have to go into one of those jobs you don't have to go into like a sciencey job if that's not what you want to do by the end of your degree there's also you know working with the police is another option doing.

Post-mortems and other sort of post death kind of analysis there's jobs within that there's just so many out there and just working as a prison officer first responder and variety of instance cows viable work experience yeah absolutely um.

I always say the most important thing when it comes to work experience for medicine is what you learn not what you did so you could work in a charity shop and that's incredible work experience so as long as you can say you know i improved my.

Um communication skills my team working skills i was able to appreciate whatever as long as you can see that from your experience then the work experience is great um and so i assume working as a prison officer you have had the opportunity to see people very vulnerable people in.

Difficult situations um as well as you must have great communication skills to do that job and the only thing is if you're going into medicine just try and at least talk to a doctor about like what exactly it is they do and but other than that no prison officer had a great experience.

Someone said how has your experience been at manchester i personally love based lightning was always like very appealing to me and so that's one of the reasons i chose manchester as well as the fact it's very friendly university.

Um very like big priority on making friendly doctors and as well as like competent doctors but very friendly daughters so that was all something that appealed to me i've enjoyed it and we get a lot of um very hands-on placement experience we start placement.

In third year third year we do exclusively emplacement so that was all great and it was full body and dissection which isn't offered that often anymore so that was great i've enjoyed it and a lot of people i know liked it like it here i guess um but if you're not interested in pvl then.

I would avoid it because it's super heavy previa someone asked how much study of physics and mass is required in medicine like not a lot i didn't do physics or maths for a level and maths was never really my thing the only time you need maths is for drug calculation so calculating doses.

But that's very simple must be honest um but again if you're very interested in like radiology and things and more into i don't know the like engineering aspect of medicine then physics and maths is obviously going to be much more important someone said if you are sure of medicine.

And you're in an interview where they ask why medicine not ex-wizard what is a good response i think this is like the question that scares everyone the most from what i like even from when i applied this is the one that people really hated because um.

People would sort of spot off their answer of this is why i want to be a doctor and they'd be like okay great why not nurse then um i would say try make it as individual to you as you can it's not always possible but if you can then do um but.

Generally the reasons why you might want to be a doctor instead of an allied health professional would be like t like being a team leader instead of just a member of the team more problem solving i suppose the ability to prescribe um more opportunities to go into.

Research generally you know nurses or midwives they don't usually go into research although they can but they just usually don't so things like that are more medical than allied health profession um.

But i would say try and get some work experience i know with covert it's really hard for you guys but if you can then you'll be able to get a feel and make sure that you want to be a doctor and not by a nurse for example um the one thing the one really good piece of advice someone told me though was like.

Don't ever slag off one of the other allied health professions because quite often they get a nurse to ask that question so when people are like oh nurses like they can get a bit upset with you so just try not to do that but.

Acknowledge that everyone in that team is important but leadership research becoming an expert in your field and problem solving i would say someone said also if i was to do biomed then medicine is post-grad how does that work with student loans cost fees oh i'm a scottish applicant.

I'm sorry guys i'm sorry about my throat so i'm obviously english so i don't fully know how the scottish system works but in terms of student loan student finance um.

You get four years of loan and then any additional years you take is nhs bursary so your first four years you get whatever student loan you get and then the nhs bursary is a lower amount than.

You can get through student loan but you don't have to pay it back and then i think you can get that for two more years but um that is obviously an issue for postgrads because they do have to pay especially if they go into an undergrad medicine degree after their.

Bachelor of science because then they're doing eight years so they don't get funded for all of those years they have to pay for some of them themselves if they ask us why i met and not by a med during interview what would a some answer be i think.

That probably wouldn't come up as a question because medicine is much more um like practical than biomed so i don't necessarily think it will come up um i guess biomed is more research based you don't really get patient interaction.

As much so the actual wanting to be face to face with patients the diagnostic prescribing again um would all be positives for doctor over biomed but i don't think that probably would come up as a doctor do you think medicine degree.

Is awarded from european medical schools on work in terms of training the skills obtained by doctors work for nhs comparing those doctors granted from uk and europe um i think going to european medical schools is very popular actually like i.

Know quite a lot of people who did go abroad if they didn't get into uk medical schools and um from what i know they've all enjoyed it there's i think outside of uk medical schools the medical schools basically the medical schools aren't uk medical schools are very focused on like the.

Like science and the educational aspect and more so than the clinical application so they're really great and everyone i know who went to those universities is incredibly clever but sometimes they just struggle a lot by getting into the swing of actually taking a really focused history.

From a patient or you know those sort of skills but obviously they can pick those skills up very quickly so all universities or medical schools outside the uk are great to be honest as long as long as it's not super dodgy one in the middle of nowhere they're great and then the outside of.

Europe the medical schools are like exceptional so they're all great everyone i know who's been abroad medical school has enjoyed it i've applied for dentistry before but as a person that got rejected how do you think getting an updated experience would be a.

Good idea so if you've got the opportunity to get more experience i obviously would i would just say like with if you for anyone who gets rejected from medical school and industry school anything um just.

Reflect on your past application and try and identify what the downfall was so if you got rejected because of an application test score for example or an interview and usually you can request feedback from universities usually they'll give it to you.

But if you can't try and think yourself as too wet were you less confident where were you less sure of yourself or struggled a little bit more and try and work on those areas any experience you can get though will improve your chance of getting in not.

Just because like on paper you then have more experience but because you'll become more confident and becomes more sure if your answers into you for example or your motivation will get better so i always recommend more experience if you didn't get in.

First time but also focus on the other aspects of application as well um and someone's uh getting experience in labs hospitals it's hard nowadays because of covered um yeah i know it's it's it's really hard for you guys um.

So like i said volunteering is always great back in the day people always would volunteer with care homes which is incredibly difficult now covered um gps are a great one if you're looking to do medicine because especially if you're in the middle of nowhere they often don't have medical students there and.

They'll happily take you for a couple of days that's why i got my work experience before i before i went to medical school um similar to if you've got like a private dentist near you they might be similar um alternatively there's a lot of like online experiences now where you can.

Watch surgeries for example i don't know what the equivalent would be in dentistry but i know you can watch surgeries or go to talks on medicine just to show that you're interested and they're great experiences i think that's all the questions at the moment if anyone's got any more.

Questions please add them i'm sorry if i didn't answer any questions correctly well i try my best also if you don't have any questions feel free to leave and i hope it was helpful for you guys how many of you forgot any more questions.

Okay so um i think it's worth reflecting on everything obviously if you didn't have the best you can score anything that's what's contributed then obviously you kind of got like smoking gun as if does if you want to see it like that um.

Where it probably was just down to that and i'm sure now you know how to work on your ucat technique to um to basically get a better score next time and even like the fact that you've done it before.

That'll make you less stressed during actually taking it and you'll be able to perform a little better next time but i would still just sit back and like reflect on all other aspects of your application because obviously when you reapply you want to be super strong um.

In all aspects so i would say obviously yeah focus on your ucat but make sure that you're still working on all the other aspects just so that you are able to sort of go in and be really strong and definitely get a place.

That's okay do you have any other questions um sick what do you mean do you mean like an interview question about um yes so sometimes questions like.

What would you do if you didn't get in those kind of questions come on questions what you mean like you could then reflect i suppose on what happened last time and how you've worked on improving that so.

I know there's other questions as well that essentially could come up which you like and how you overcome not adversity actually how they work and how you overcome like setbacks and things yeah of course you can include you didn't get in first time and then just make sure you discuss what you've.

Learned from that experience so saying like um like i didn't get in and when i reflected reflection is like a big buzzword there's only like i reflected i identified these issues and i've done x y and z to improve them so you know i.

Took more experience i um obviously practiced more but things taking things like taking more experience looks really really impressive so of course you can include it and just make sure you don't sit there like i didn't get in first time oh and then leaving it there because obviously.

That's not great but if you can say something like i didn't get in obviously it was difficult but when i reflected i saw that um that these were my weaknesses and this is what i've done to improve it and now i am much more confident much um more ready to you know do whatever.

I think that looks really impressive so as long as you include what you've learned from those experiences yes of course you can include that okay oops do you have any more questions i'll just give you one moment in case you're typing but um.

Feel free to leave if you'd have more questions no worries good luck this time i'm sure you'll get it i'm sure you'll be fine yeah fingers are pumping squash for you as well

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